File 1711/1920 'Mesopotamia: General Circulars. - 1920' [‎60r] (124/591)

Annexure to General Circular No. 873, dated 23rd August, 1920.
Proceedings of Mesopotamian Debates in the Houses of Lords and Commons.
MESOPOTAMIA.
Statement by Prime Minister.
Sir D. MACLEAN: On a point of Order.
It might be for the convenience of the Committee,
in view of the fact that this, I think, is the first
occasion on which these Estimates have been
presented in their new. form, if you could give us
some guidance as to how; you think that the
Debate should proceed. As a rule,' of course, we
can select our Votes and get our issues on the
separate Votes, but there is no intimation on the
Order Paper how the Votes are to, be taken.
Hon. Members have to go to the White Paper for
information as to what heads are to be taken.
It is desired to-day, certainly on two, occasions,
to have the decision of the Committee. Perhaps
you, would inform the Committee what is your
view as to the new procedure.
The CHAIRMAN : The right Hon. Gentle
man will recollect that in December last year,
when the Votes were first presented in this new
form, I drew the' attention'of the Committee to
them and particularly said that I was most anxious
that the new form of Estimates should not take
away from the Committee any of its rights to move
and take a decision upon the reduction of any
item. It is for the reason that I myself requested
the War Office, in the presentation ofthis Vote, to
put down the details which appear and Which, if
desired, I will read to the Committee. The sum
of £10,000,000, which is-the Vote before the
Committee, is divided under the following
heads
6 ''US
“ Head I.—Maintenance of Stand-
mg Army ... 3,000,000
Head V.—-Capital Accounts ... 1,000,000
Head IV._War Office, Staff of
.Commands, &. ... 1,000,000
Head IL—Territorial and Reserve
Forces ... ... 1,000,000
Head III.—E ducational, &c.,
Establishments and
Working Expenses of '
Hospitals, Depots, &c. 1,000,000
Head VI.—’Terminal and Miscel
laneous Charges' and
Receipts ' ... 2,000,000
Head VI I.—Half-pay, Retired pay.
Pensions and Civil
Superannuation ... 1,000,000 ’ ‘
That has been done in order to enable Members
of the Committee to move reductions under the
various heads, and the order of them has been
arranged in accordance -with the request of the
Opposition, so that they may bring forward first
the points which they desire to raise. With
regard to to-day’s proceedings in particular, I
propose, first of all, to take an Amendment’
dealing with the expenditure in Mesopotamia,
having been informed that is the first thing that
the Committee desires to discuss, I understand
that may be disposed of about 8 o’clock. If that
be the case, I propose, following that to take an
Amendment for the reduction of the head dealing
with the question of the scarlet uniform. If
those two be disposed of, then any other matter
will be open up, till 11 o’clock.
SIR D. MACLEAN : Do you not think that it
would be for the convenience of hon. Members if
there appeared on the Order Paper to-day, instead
of simply Vote on account, the heads 1, 5, 4,2,3,
6 and 7, then we should have the whole of the.
information under one heading.
The CHAIRMAN : I think that would be
misleading. Every Member of the House has
had circulated to him this .Vote with, the details,
and, in accordance with custom, the Order Paper
to-day refers t J that statement.
LIEUT.-COMMANDER KENWORTHY: Could
you inform us in what way you are going to put
the question ?. Will it be the whole £10,000,000,
or will you run through these headings ? If you
put the question of the whole £10,000,000, will
you take the various reductions under the various,
heads which you have just mentioned ?
.The CHAIRMAN : Yes, that is what I in
tended to say. Although I put the question of the
whole £10,000,000 to the Committee, I shall take,
first an Amendment for a reduction in respect of
the expenditure in Mesopotamia.
LIEUT.-COMMANDER KENWORTHY : Do you
intend to confine the Debate strictly to the
question of Mesopotamia, or will you. permit us,
for example, to refer to Persia, which I think, is
brought in, and, if /so, what other areas in Asia
will it be admissible to discuss ?
The CHAIRMAN : It would be to the advan
tage of the Committee, I think, to take a definite
issue as far as possible and pot to be too discursive.
I do not say that there may not be analogies and
references to other parts of the Near East—I
; must be guided in that matter by the way in which
the Debate proceeds-—but I understand that it is
the desire to concentrate in the first place on the
question of Mesopotamia.
Sir D. MACLEAN : ’ The Vote itself includes
North-West Persia.
Lieut.-Colonel GUINNESS: If Mesopo
tamia is to be taken first, would it not be con
venient if we could have read to us the telegram
alleged to have been received this morning from
Baghdad? Several hon. Members have searched
the “ Times ” and the “ Daily Chronicle ” for this
telegram and can find no trace of it. I do not
know what was the newspaper in whichthe right
hon. Gentleman the Secretary of State- for India
said that it appeared this morning, but it would
probably shorten the Debate and save a good deal
of unnecessary discussion if, we could have it read
to us now.
The CHAIRMANS That is not'a point of
Order. It is open to any Minister to rise if he
desires in the first place to put certain information
before the Committee..
Lord R. CECIL : I do not know whether I
might venture to appeal to my right hon. Friend,
but in view of what took place at question time,
would it not be courteous to the Committee to
read the statement to us ?
The SECRETARY of STATE for INDIA
(Mr. Montagu) : The Prime Minister intended to
read the telegram, and, if hon. Members wish me
to read it, I shall be very glad to do so. It reads :