File of printed papers marked 'Egyptian negotiation' between Curzon and Adly Pasha and the Egyptian delegation [‎35v] (70/178)

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He would take an imaginary situation, one which might not arise, but which had
arisen in other countries, notably Afghanistan. Supposing there was trouble in Cairo
responsible people in Egypt ? Lord Curzon thought they would be horrified. They
had to think of the reasoning minority, not the shouting majority, with little stake in
the country.
Adly Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. replied that there was not a fraction of the population who
desired the maintenance of British forces. Even those who had abandoned Zaghlul
to support the Minis 4 ry still insisted on the withdrawal of British troops. They would
say that the British troops which Lord Milner agreed were to be localised are now
going to perform precisely the same duties as an army of occupation.
Lord Curzon said that he did not put the case quite fairly. Adly Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. was
assuming that the British forces would remain at their present strength of 10,000 or
12,000 men. This was not at all the case. Adly Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. further assumed that the
British forces would act as they are now acting. Again tins was not the case. When
Egypt had a responsible Government it would be for that Government to maintain
order, no doubt in close consultation with the High Commissioner, who would be
reluctant to move troops to any town simply for the sake of displaying force. On the
contrary, he would wish to keep them in the background until the Egyptian Government
told him that their own arrangements had broken down, and applied to him for
assistance.
Adly Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. said that this argument was based on the idea that Egypt would never
have a reliable police force or army.
Lord Curzon said that the creation of a reliable force would take a little time;
Egypt had good material, and when the time came we would be quite prepared to
reconsider the situation if by then a really reliable native force was in existence.
At present he had to consider the infancy of that force, and during its babyhood
British troops must be available.
Rushdi Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. said that if in the disorders of 1919 there had been a few foreign
victims, and if there had recently been bloodshed in Alexandria, it was explained by
the ill-feeling which had existed in the past, and which would disappear when an
agreement had been reached Lord Curzon had said that the other Powers would
not agree. Was it to be expected that the Powers would ask Great Britain to
exercise wider privileges than the Powers themselves had possessed? Under the
Capitulations the privileges enjoyed by the Powers were purely judicial. In Alexandria
British troops had been used because they were there ; if they had not been, the
Egyptians would have had their own organisation to deal with the situation.
Sidky Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. pointed out that, in existing circumstances, the British troops were
in fact part of their organisation.
Rushdi Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. said that the Egyptians could never accept the presence of British
forces to maintain order or to protect foreigners. They could only accept them for the
protection of Imperial communications.
Lord Curzon said he had no intention of putting in the forefront of the treaty
anything about the presence of British troops being necessary to maintain order.
The note which he had drawn up and communicated to the delegation was of a
confidential character, and simply explained the reasons which were in all their minds
for the presence of the troops. In the future, when the Egyptian Government needed
the troops they would forget about the importance of Imperial communications. It
was unnecessary to say anything about the maintenance of order, but it was important
to keep clear in their own minds the real reasons necessitating the presence of British
troops. In the last resort the disposition of troops would be settled by the soldiers,
and it would be settled from a military point of view. He wished to be quite frank
and to make it plain at once that the British military authorities would never
consent to the troops being confined to the Canal zone.
Rushdi Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. said that the vital interests of Great Britain were her communications.
If these were safeguarded, why need she ask for more?
Lord Curzon pointed out that the Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. was merely repeating the same argument.
Adly Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. then enquired how the presence of troOps'was to be explained.
Lord Curzon said that he was prepared to explain it in any way most acceptable
to the Egyptian people.
Shafik Pasha An Ottoman title used after the names of certain provincial governors, high-ranking officials and military commanders. then enquired how the other Powers would regard the absence of
any mention of the maintenance of order as being one of the reasons for the presence
of ti’oops, if this was to form part of a secret agreement.
Lord Curzon said there was no question of a secret agreement. He was merely
endeavouring to arrive at an understanding with the delegation as to the real reasons
for the presence of British troops.